[MlMt] really delete

[Bill Cole]

On 27 Oct 2016, at 11:53, Gary Hull wrote:

> Randy,
>
> By putting individual's email addresses in the To slot, you're causing 
> mailing list conversations to show up in the Inbox even if the mailing 
> list is redirected to the Mailing List mailbox.

It's worse than that. The list seems to be configured to add its own 
Reply-To header directing replies to the list and apparently has 
MailMan's "Avoid duplicate copies of messages" feature set on by 
default. The result is that I never received the message Randy sent via 
the list. Adding to that, because I use a distinct address for every 
discussion list I'm on, I filter everything sent to one of those 
addresses which is NOT via the list into a slopbucket mailbox which is 
almost all spam to the address I use on the SpamAssassin list (ah, the 
irony...) So if one sends a message to me "offlist" I'm unlikely to see 
it soon and if it is CC'd to the list, I never get the copy via the 
list.

> Please only put MailMate Users in the To slot. Bill, et al., will 
> still see it. If you need to put an individual's email there, hide it 
> in BCC.

Or just honor the Reply-To and don't generate duplicates.

But, moving on to the point of the thread...

> On 27 Oct 2016, at 23:43, Randy Bush wrote:
>
>> ok, i decided to test.
>>
>>   o i am in SOURCES
>>
>>   o i subscribed to Deleted Messages on the server
>>
>>   o i delete a message from my inbox with the DEL key
>>
>>   o i look in Deleted Messages; there are eight messages there but 
>> not
>>     the one i just deleted

MM has for some reason decided that Some Other Mailbox is your logical 
"Deleted Messages" mailbox, not the one actually named Deleted Messages.

>>   o the right click menu on Delete Messages does not offer to empty 
>> the
>>     mailbox
>>
>>   o i look manually (ls) on the server and the eight messages are in
>>     that mbox file, but not the one i just deleted from my inbox

Because the mailbox named "Deleted Messages" isn't the IMAP mailbox that 
MM thinks is operationally the account's trashcan. It just happens to 
have a matching but entirely non-magical name. My guess is that 
*something* is using that mailbox (or did at one point) but that 
unsubscribing MM from it caused MM to create a new mailbox to play that 
role.

>>   o use my other imap client and it sees that deleted message still 
>> in
>>     the inbox

That's wrong. That client is out of sync with the server OR is ignoring 
the \Deleted flag.

>>   o i go back to mailmate but to Deleted Messages in MAILBOXES, and 
>> that
>>     message and a hundred others are there

You can determine which mailbox *THAT* is: with a message there, 
right-click on the column header and select Source Mailbox.

My bet is that it's named Trash.

>>   o right click on Deleted Messages in MAILBOXES does offer an empty
>>     mailbox option

Of course it does: that's the IMAP source mailbox MM thinks is the 
logical Deleted Messages mailbox.

>>   o i take the empty mailbox option and go back to INBOX in SOURCES.
>>     the nine messages are there and colored red.  in a minute or so 
>> they
>>     go away

That's positively weird. How did they get back THERE??? The red text 
means that there's a pending operation involving those messages. It's a 
bit disconcerting that you see them there AND that it takes more than a 
few seconds for them to go away.

>>   o my other imap client can no longer see that deletd message
>>
>> so, Deleted Messages in MAILBOXES does not have the same semantics as
>> the one in SOURCES

I'm pretty sure this is primarily a problem of mistaken identity. It is 
not clear to me why messages are re-appearing in INBOX, but I bet it 
will be fixed by finding what mailbox you're looking at as 
Mailboxes->Deleted Messages->[accountname] by right-clicking on the 
Sources->[accountname]->Deleted Messages mailbox and selecting Mailbox 
Type->Deleted Messages.